Length: 37:26
[cassette tape starting effect]
[Excerpts of speeches from Shirley Chisholm, Toni Morrison, Malcolm X, and Angela Davis]
["Hip Hop Instrumental 2" by Ketsa]
Jo'-Hannah: Hey guys, I'm Jo'-Hannah Valentin—
Shay: —and I'm Shay Milner—
Jo: —and you're listening to Black Tea.
Shay: Black Tea is a podcast through Vanderbilt University that strives to highlight underrepresented and undiscovered perspectives on campus. This month, we are doing a mini-series in commemoration of Black History Month, where we will be interviewing influential black faculty on campus about topics ranging from black feminism and masculinity, black literature, the origins of black history, and black Greek life.
Jo: This month, we'll be drinking black tea because of course, black tea, black history, black everything, you gotta be blacker than black during Black History Month.
Shay: — exactly—
Jo: —so we just thought that drinking black tea this month would exemplify what we had planned just to learn about black history, you know, all these things that we previously said.
Shay: So for the historical fact of the day, we're going to be talking about the Combahee River Collective.
Jo: For locals in South Carolina, they'll most likely pronounce it "combee," but for this episode, we'll be pronouncing it "combuhee."
Shay:The website "Black Past" states that the Combahee River Collective was “founded by black feminists and lesbians in Boston, Massachusetts in 1974” and based its name on “a resistance action by Harriet Tubman in 1863 in South Carolina. . . Tubman freed more that 750 slaves in this unique military campaign, the only one in U.S. history conceived and directed by a woman.”
Jo: The collective is more famous for the Combahee River Collective Statement, whose opening line reads, “We are a collective of Black feminists who have been meeting together since 1974. During that time we have been involved in the process of defining and clarifying our politics, while at the same time doing political work within our own group and in coalition with other progressive organizations and movements. The most general statement of our politics at the present time would be that we are actively committed to struggling against racial, sexual, heterosexual, and class oppression, and see as our particular task the development of integrated analysis and practice based upon the fact that the major systems of oppression are interlocking. The synthesis of these oppressions creates the conditions of our lives. As Black women we see Black feminism as the logical political movement to combat the manifold and simultaneous oppressions that all women of color face.”
Shay: If you guys would like to learn more about the Combahee River Collective, we will be linking some articles below that explain the history of the collective as well as including a link to the statement that Jo'-Hannah just read an excerpt from. And finally, we will link below more resources about the history of black feminism and how that is differentiated from the white feminists and the civil rights movement.
Jo: Okay, guys, so for the quote of the day, this quote is by Audre Lorde, and it's really powerful in my opinion. So the quote is, "When I dare to be powerful— to use my strength in the service of my vision— then it becomes less and less important, whether I am afraid."
Jo: So I really think that this is extremely important, especially for women, since this episode today will be focused on feminism and just kind of how that relates to black history. So I think it's super important just because a lot of times to do things, you have a lot of fear backed behind that, and you may be scared to take that step, to make that action, to say that word. But when you are able to see your vision, when you are that determined to make your vision come and be a reality, then that vision is so powerful, that it's less important whether you're afraid and the fact that you know, you may still have that fear, but it's less important that you are afraid and more important that you're getting the things that you want to be done and actually going through the actions, the movements to do those things, even throughout that fear. So I just think that's really important—
Shay: —and aside from even just black feminism, this idea of fearlessness and power, were and are the backbone of the black freedom movement.
Jo: And if they were overtaken by that fear, then we wouldn't—
Shay: —we wouldn't have the freedoms that we have now.
[water boiling effect]
Shay: So for our Self Care Tip of the Day, we're drawing from the website "Best Life Online," and it states. "If someone tells you they love your outfit or are impressed by your work on a project, don't respond by denying it or putting yourself down. Instead, accept it and say 'thank you.' It's not as challenging as you think, and it will make you feel really great about yourself in the process." And I think this is especially important for women to hear, because I feel like I find myself— a lot of times— apologizing or downplaying a compliment. So if someone's like, I like your hair, I like your shirt. I'll be like, "Oh, no, it's not that great—"
Jo: — I'm like, "this is so cheap—"
Shay: — yeah, "it's so cheap," or, like, if someone's like "you did really good on a presentation," "Oh, I feel like I messed up," like, no, own the compliment.
Jo: Exactly. I like saying "thank you," but just be like, "thanks. I know," even though you may not think that, originally, just saying that and, like, kind of affirming yourself will really just boost your confidence.
Shay: Yeah, it's completely fine to say "I know" when someone compliments you.
Jo: Exactly. I love it when people say that. It's like, "your outfits cute," "I know, I picked up this morning."
Shay: Okaaaay.
[laughs]
[pouring water effect]
Jo: So for today's episode, we will be talking to Dr. David Ikard, a tenured professor of African American and Diaspora Studies at Vanderbilt University. Although this episode is focused on the politics of black gender, Dr. Ikard discusses with us topics ranging from intersectionality, appropriation and tokenism.
[Transition: "We Shall Overcome"]
Shay: Would you like to introduce yourself?
Dr. David Ikard: Yes, my name is David Ikard. I'm a professor in African American Diaspora Studies. I have been at Vanderbilt now this is my third year, um, author of four books, everything from black feminism, to post racial politics in Barack Obama's America. I like interdisciplinary, critical engagement. I like anything that has to do with African American communities and empowerment and in particularly notions of masculinity, and how that is. . . how it plays out in various kind of spaces in our society.
Dr. Ikard: That's kind of me in a nutshell. I also paint, by the way—
Jo: —oh, yeah, your paintings are amazing.
Dr. Ikard: Yeahh—
Shay: —what do you paint?
Dr. Ikard: Uhh. . . you know, I love portraits of black folks, particularly, you know, I do a lot of portraits about black life. I love. . . I keep coming back to these portraits of black women and natural hair, so there's a lot of afros and cornrows and, and locks in my work so yeah, yeah and political. There's some things that are about, you know, Black Lives Matter about, like, the Civil Rights Movement. I'm a I'm a big big if— you know, Jo'-Hannah's taken my class now she will know that I'm a huge fan of James Baldwin. I think he is one of the greatest thinkers of the, you know, the last generation and one of the greatest thinkers in US history, right, frankly, him along with people like Toni Morrison, W. E. B. DuBois, and others. Um, but he, he is almost like timeless in his, kind of, engagement with our collective conscience as Americans who are engaged in this experiment we call democracy. Right? So yeah, that's, that's kind of what I do. And I'm always discovering other kinds of things that I like, which is a beautiful part of being an academic, is that I get to explore aspects of myself, and I get to find all these different and very cool outlets of expression, modes of expression, which a brotha needs to keep his sanity.
[laughs]
Shay: Can you say the name of the class that Jo'-Hannah's taking?
Dr. Ikard: That's a. . . What is it, "Black Masculinity," and like—
Jo: — "Black Masculinity, Social Image and Public Policy."
Dr. Ikard: There you go. We do less public policy than we do constructions of black masculinity. It's not a course I constructed, is just when I teach and I just modify to. . . to the things that are. . . I always teach to my strengths. So. . .
Dr. Ikard: You won't understand how we make laws and how we construct surveillance and police bodies if you don't understand how we construct, deploy, weaponize certain aspects of masculinity, which in many cases makes it confusing for a lot of black men, in terms of even trying to figure out what it means to be a man. What it means to operate in a space where you don't have to be afraid. I think a lot of times, when we think about black masculinity and the ways it's constructed in our society, we. . . it's all about, kind of, pop culture that's, you know, of course run through white supremacy. So black men are strong and hard and always already dangerous and potentially lethal. Right? Mike Brown, the way that the
the police officer, the white police officer— who was himself, six foot four, like 250, I forget,
big, just, big dude, who shot and killed Mike Brown, who, you know, was unarmed— described him as like, "what, when I, when I when I first shot him—" because they asked, like, "why did you shoot him so many times—" like when I first shot him, the bullet seemed to like make him mad and he rose up—
[Excerpt from the interview with Darren Wilson]
Wilson: —after I looked at him and he's kind of shot, he gets even angrier. His aggression, his face, the intensity just increases, and he comes back at me again—
Dr. Ikard: —right? Like he's some like—
Jo: —is that even possible?
Dr. Ikard— like he was some kind of—
Shay: — yeah—
Dr. Ikard: — like a Godzilla movie.
Shay: Yeah.
Dr. Ikard: You know? And, mind you, like, Mike Brown was in a car, so he's shooting down, right. And, mind you, too, this was like Mike Brown had done nothing wrong, other than like, you know, express a certain self of an agency, like, "you can't treat me or talk to me any kind of way." And so he ends up getting killed and he's unarmed, but his, his physical presence is itself so constructed as such a threat that not only did you, like, have to shoot him once, you had to, you had to riddle his body with bullets, right?
Dr. Ikard: Trayvon Martin, the, the. . . when Zimmerman's attorney is making this case against Trayvon Martin. And you say, well how, you know. . . like Trayvon Martin's this teenager. He's unarmed. He's walking home. He literally has a Snapple and some Skittles in his hand. I mean, literally, you know, he's getting a sugar fix on. And this, this dude who's a grown man, who's literally 100 pounds bigger, armed with a loaded weapon. Ends up, of course, as we know, killing Trayvon, after accosting him. But in the court, the. . . Zimmerman's attorney was like, "Yeah, they keep saying that Trayvon was unarmed, but they keep leaving out some major, major variable. He was armed with the sidewalk—"
[Excerpt from Zimmerman's trial]
O'Mara: —[dusting off his hands] that is a sidewalk. And that is not an "unarmed teenager" with nothing but Skittles, trying to get home. That was somebody who used the availability of dangerous items, from his fist to the concrete, to cause great bodily injury against George Zimmerman—
Dr. Ikard: —"that's where he slams Zimmerman—"
[laughs]
Jo: —I didn't know that was considered a weapon.
Dr. Ikard: It's like "Yo," like, whenever your, your body is constructed as more lethal than an automatic weapon, dude, that means there is an endless amount of justification that can be given for taking your life. So one of the major emotions that black men have that rarely gets any attention is fear. Like, most black men— and particularly young black men— are walking around in a state of fear. And they mask it with their, with their clothes you know a lot of bulky clothes, a lot of sagging, a lot of whatever, with this, it's this kind of like "gangster" pose kind of thug pose, where they're like, "Look, don't mess with me," whatever, whatever. But at the end of the day, when you survey these brothas, and say, "well, what's your you know, how would you describe yourself?" "What's your, like, number one emotion?" Consistently, most of them say fear.
Dr. Ikard: So if these, these young brothas are walking around afraid, and our society has constructed them as not only, like, dominant and rough and rugged and lethal, right, if confronted, and they're walking around afraid, that is a recipe for disaster, right? And I have a 17-year-old-son. And so I am constantly, when he wants to go out and hang out with his friends. I'm like "yo be home by 11, cat." And you have to explain to him, like, 'cause he's like, "yo, you know, like, I'm not being irresponsible." I'm like, "you're not being irresponsible, you have a 4.1 or two GPA, you're in the IB program, you're a good kid, you've never been in trouble." I'm like, "I'm not afraid about what you will do, I'm afraid for you. Because all that beauty, all of that brilliance, all of that tenderness, all that love, they don't, they're not gonna see that." I have to treat the police like they are thugs because the police act like thugs,
act like gangs. They won't tell on each other. They won't hold each other accountable. They do their own investigations time and time again, find no fault when some things are just absolutely perverse in their corruption. It's literally only when people are caught red-handed, that you even get some type of accountability.
Jo: Yeah. That's a. . . woo.
Shay: Yeah, that's a lot—
[laughs]
Shay: Well, it's actually good then because we are talking about black feminism today. So it's really good to see black masculinity and just see the dichotomy between the two.
Dr. Ikard: Absolutely. Absolutely, absolutely.
Jo: Um, so the first few questions are basically just if you could describe, like, what white feminism is versus black womanism, and then how did they emerge, and who did each of those benefit?
Dr. Ikard: I mean, there's always been, you know, just like, any type of resistance movement, there's always been elements of folks who have been marginalized, who are pushing for, for change, right? But what we see— and this becomes important when we start out my black feminism— what we see is that even within the context of resistance movements, a lot of times groups that are engaged in resistance movements who have other aspects of privilege— be it social, be it racial, be it in terms of class, or, or sexuality— that when they tend to push for change in terms of equality, there is often a impulse to ignore other ways in which they function as perpetuators or complicit agents in other forms of oppression, right? So, when the mainstream— quote unquote, mainstream— white feminist movement really gained a lot of, you know, steam— particularly in the, you know, 1960s, in the started to move into the mainstream— part of the issue was that this is also. . . feminism is also coming into its heyday at the dawn of the civil rights movement, right?. So a lot of black women who empathize with, you know, the these issues of women's oppression are, like, coming to these white feminists and is like, "Look, uh, you guys keep talking about gender— which we are absolutely down for, we like the idea of the personal being political, right? So that I can talk about my experiences as a, as a woman as something that is legitimate for me to talk about, something that matters, something that we should pay attention to. But, yo, why are we not also talking about, like, white supremacy? Because most of you guys are middle-class white women, and part of what you're pushing for is a space in the men's club, right? You want to get access to good jobs, access to power, you want to be treated as an equal. And if you decide that you want to be in a, you know, heteronormative relationship, traditional marriage, whatever, you want people to recognize that even within the context of domesticity— you're cooking and you're cleaning, you're taking care of the kids— that that's labor, that should be recognized, right? But when black women want to come into the space, you want us to be tokens. You want us to be mascots, you don't want us to talk about racism."
Dr. Ikard: And also— and this is a very crucial point that a lot of folks miss out, particularly black men when they hear black women talking about feminism— part of one of the things that black women push was like, "yo, you keep talking about like women, but black men are being oppressed here in ways that white women aren't. Right? And white women are complicit in supporting white men in that oppression, in erasure of black men's subordinate status and oppression. And we not, we're not down for that, like we want to address patriarchy because it does affect us. It does affect the black community. But you can't, I mean, we look like fools here, when, you know. we're in a segregated society, you know, black men are being beat up and killed and, and whatever— these are our sons, these are
our uncles, these are our fathers, these are our boyfriends, these are our lovers. Right? And you guys are talking about, 'well, if you empower women, then all that other stuff fixes itself,' and like, 'No, no, no, you're talking about white women and no, it does not.'"
Dr. Ikard: And then, of course, the brothas are like, "Well, why are you over there with them white women talking about, like, feminism? That's. . . you know, those white women don't give a damn about black men, and black male, male suffering, you know what I'm saying?" So, like, a lot of black feminists were like, turned off by the fact that, for black men, they were considered sellouts. Right? Because, you know, white feminists weren't talking about black men. They weren't thinking about black people, in most cases at all. And of course, black men, part of the ways in which we have constructed our sense of liberation and freedom was through this notion of occupying a more traditional, breadwinner, protector role that a lot of men felt like was our rightful place. And so if you are a black woman you are pushing not only against, like, these white women who are erasing and exploiting your, your race to their kind of larger, you know, agenda, but you, also within a black community, in order to have solidarity with black men, you had to erase the ways in which black men were reproducing kind of patriarchal notions where men were supposed to be dominant over women and women were supposed to be silent and support men, and that, when you looked at issues of oppression in the black community, it really started with black men and kind of snowballed out. So black men were saying, "Well, if you take care of. . . if black men are liberated and free, then it's going to trickle down to everybody else." That's why the, the famous black feminists anthology is All the Women are White, All the Blacks are Men, But Some of Us are Brave, right?
Jo: Mh. That was good. It just, kind of, made me think about, like, how everything intersects. Like, I've heard this in classes previous, like, the intersectionality of race, gender and class and just, like, how that all kind of, like, melds into not one problem, but like, multiple problems in this mountain of problems— [laughs]
Dr. Ikard: —yeah, yeah, sure.
Jo: So yeah.
Dr. Ikard: Absolutely. And you have to think about. . . black feminists rarely get credit for inventing intersectionality. Right? Kimberlé Crenshaw, she comes up with a terminology, it's a very sophisticated discourse. She talks about, you can't talk about people's subjectivity, which is, you know, the types of power dynamics that impose their will on people and informs what they can and cannot do. You cannot say, "Oh, she's a woman." "Oh, he's black." And then, and and that is somehow variables that help you understand someone's subjectivity. It's like, no, what if they're black, a woman and working class or black and Jewish and have African parents, right? So they have an immigrant background. Or, they're trans and biracial, and from the south, right? All of these discourses intersect to inform who they are and the types of challenges that they have to confront in order to, kind of, move through the world. And so you can't simply separate out one thing and say, you know, "if we fix racism or if we fix sexism, right? Or transphobia," whatever the case may be," then it's going to fix everything." What black feminism says like, one of the reasons, particularly if you empower queer black women who are from the working class, you're pretty much going to cover everybody, right? You're gonna hit the class, sexuality, race, right?
Dr. Ikard: And, but it's 1960s or 1970s. People weren't trying to hear about that, you know, and a lot, there was a lot of black women, because a lot of those vanguard black feminists were queer identified, right? Or what we would say today— they wouldn't say it then but— sexually fluid, right? Michele Wallace writes about this in Back Macho, right? She basically says, "look, we're at these, these meetings in which I'm, you know, empowering black women," and there's a lot of black women who, like, "look, I'm down with what you guys are trying to do. But, you know, this whole discourse of black feminism gets us marked as not only anti-black male, but as queer, and a lot of us are heterosexual and we want to get married. And so we can't really, we can't get down with this like, so we don't be like, we want to participate, but in a kind of clandestine way. We're scared of what that label could potentially. . . how that will affect our relationship to community."
Dr. Ikard: And that's very real because— particularly when you have limited commnity support, and that community solidarity is life. It's literally your protection, it's literally your definition, it's your support network. To be potentially alienated from that is incredibly frightful. If you don't think that's significant, ask yourself "Why is it that, in the NFL, right, when at least 40 to 50% of our population identifies as liberal, that nary like one or two white football players has stood up for Colin Kaepernick? Why?" Because tribalism, 'cause they're like, "yo, like, this ain't just about standing up for him like, yo, I'm a white dude, like, what will, like, me stepping out and supporting this black dude may get me thrown out of the tribe—"
Jo: Mhm, like will they lose their endorsement—
Dr. Ikard: —oh my god, but not even just, not even just the, like, the material thing, that that is itself is significant, right Jo'-Hannah? Like that's huge. That's a lot of money. But I'm, I'm talking about something deeper than that. Like white people looking at you going like, "Yo, so like, Yo like you like—" you know, and then wouldn't say this today, they'd say it in my day— they were like, "yo, so you a 'nigga lova,' like, what's that about?" You know what I'm saying? So, he gets up there, and he talks all this stuff about, like, white people and against the flag and whatever. And you up there endorsing that, what kind of white dude are you? I'm saying, where's your allegiance?
Dr. Ikard: See, Donald Trump has got that discourse down to a science. Right? He goes "those people, foreigners," right? "Let's make America great again."
[Excerpt from Trump's speech]
Trump: Together, we will make America great again.
Dr. Ikard: Right? You know, and this of course— this notion of how you code language to perpetuate certain types of discourses of racism, sexism— is not new. Right? He's just performing a new version of it, or the most update version of it. But you know, it's a it's a nod, nod, wink, wink. It's like what they call "dog whistle politics," right? So you can blow that dog whistle, nobody else can hear it, but those dogs can hear it. So it's at a frequency that only
a select group of people can hear. So when he's doing this kind of, you know, "let's make America great again, let's build walls and borders—"
[Excerpt from Trump's speech]
Crowd: Build the wall! Build the wall!
Dr. Ikard: —whatever. Oh, he's sending out very clear messages to white supremacists that, "yo, yeah, we know who those people are. We know what we're creating borders, we're not talking about Canada's border, we're not walking about the Canadian border, right? We know what border you're talking about. We know what who those people are—"
[Excerpt from Trump's speech]
Trump: —nearly 180,000 illegal immigrants with criminal records, ordered deported from our country, are tonight roaming free to threaten peaceful citizens.
Dr. Ikard: We know what it means to "make America great again," right? We're going back in the day when we had control over black folks, over brown folks, where you could say things like "white supremacy" and you could use the N-word anytime you want to and nobody's gonna like, you're not gonna lose your job. You can discriminate against people that are gay, you can discriminate against people that are Jewish, or people that you don't really like, for whatever reason, right? You could keep them out of your establishment, you can run them out of your neighborhood. All of those discourses are old, right, and just being reborn and what's, what's frightening is how easy we can invoke these discourses from the past that would dehumanize people and justify all types of violence and perversions, right? How easily all that could get turned back in like a matter of, of years.
Jo: Yeah, I think it's scary. Just because like, in reality, these things, they haven't really changed—
Dr. Ikard: —yes, yes—
Jo: —they've just, kind of, been covered with like euphemisms and different things just to hide kind of like from plain view what it is and then just to have someone that can just bring that out and make it to where people are like, "wait a minute, so this has always existed." It's just like, more prominent, and what we can see now—
Dr. Ikard: —absolutely. James Baldwin would say, "power always makes concessions to stay on top." Right? It will always adapt, right, to stay in power. So it's like, "okay, we can't call people, we can't call people the N-word anymore, we can't call women the b-word anymore. Dude, we can't do those publicly. So what can we do?" We can say thugs.
We can say—
Shay: — we can say urban—
Dr. Ikard: —we can say urban. People now have learned how to, like code, their, language and their behaviors in ways that makes it very, very difficult to say that this is what it was. Someone says, "No, no, no, that was just a misunderstanding. I didn't call her a B-word. I didn't use the N-word. I didn't use any kind of racial epithet dada dada. It was just a misunderstanding." Or as I learned when I was coming up through the profession, and ways that some of my white colleagues would like justify certain kind of racist behavior, and then you would call them out on it. And they say, "Well, David, that sounds very concerning. But I don't recall saying that." Now, "recall" is a brilliant, brilliant words—
Shay: —yes—
Dr. Ikard: —because it's not that you didn't say it.
Shay & Jo: You don't remember—
[laughs]
Dr. Ikard: —you just don't remember saying it. That gives you all this space that you're not lying technically. But you're also not it. . . you're admitting to nothing. And I was like, "Oh. . ."
Jo: Wow. Um, that was amazing. Thank you for your insight.
Shay: Yeah, thank you so much, and then showing how connected these different issues are, like, we started on black masculinity, went to fem— white feminism versus black feminism, now we're back in, like, coded language, and, like, just all of these different issues—
Jo: —just how everything connects—
Shay: —yeah—
Jo: —it's really amazing.
Dr. Ikard: —yeah—
Shay: —there's no way to separate any of the history.
Dr. Ikard: And, look, give credit where credit is due. Like, those brilliant black feminists back in the day, they saw it, they saw the formula. Now they're talking about intersectionality in sociology and anthropology and dududado, like they invented that. I see like, white sociologist who know nothing about black feminism talking about intersectionality as if they invented it. They have no, they don't even know who Kimberlé Crenshaw is, and you go like, "yo, that's like straight, it's like—" what do they call it? What are they calling cornrows with these like—
Jo: —oh like the twists?
Dr. Ikard: Like some twists—
Shay: —oh. I know they're calling bantu knots "space buns."
Dr. Ikard: "Space buns?" [laughs]
Jo: No. Oh, no, not my bantu knots.
[laughs]
Shay: Yeah the "new space buns trend,"
Dr. Ikard: "Space buns," [laughs]. \
Jo: Wow, that really hurt me.
Dr. Ikard: Yeah. Like, you know, there was some, some dance my son was telling me about that's now on TikTok, and some young white kids are calling it the "kickback." "This is the kickbacks.," it's like, what? It's like, "yo, like, y'all need to stop that appropriation like that's like, like, for real? That's not cute, like stop—"
Jo:— at least give credit where credit is due—
Dr. Ikard: — give credit where credit is due like, yo, like, bring some black woman stylist on there and talk about this right? Give them—
Jo: —and, like, the origins, just to make it seem like, "okay, we're appreciating this and like, yeah, we're like, we want to change it to fit us but like, we want to appreciate where it originated from."
Dr. Ikard: Yo, like you making me think about that. . . What's that white woman from Australia, that was, like, big for like a minute. . .
Dr. Ikard: Iggy Azalea.
Jo & Shay: Oh yes.
Dr. Ikard: She was, and she was on the cover of GQ, like the "new face of hip hop," like and she's straight appropriating literally the cadences of black women and black women, they won't ever let more than like one or two in the scene at a time and suddenly, she's coming from all Australia and blowing up? Word? So they like black women's, like, vibe and energy and flow. It's sexy, so long as it's coming through a white body, and then it makes it palatable then, it becomes new and innovative and great, but when it's in a black body—
Jo: —they're an angry black women with an attitude—
Dr. Ikard: —right? But now it's like, "yo this is hot, it's hot. What is she doing, look at them gestures! Yo, that's like, that's fire. That's fire."
[laughs]
Dr. Ikard: Right, right, did you learn that in the trap?
Shay: Man.
Jo: That's a whole other conversation.
Shay: Man.
Dr. Ikard: I'm just saying. Se y'all got, see it's early, I done had my second cup of cappuccino, y'all better get me off this program, I'ma start naming names.
Shay: We're gonna have to get you back on here because you have a lot to say.
[laughs]
Shay: But, um, thank you so much—
Dr. Ikard: — absolutely
Shay: —for talking with us today, sharing all of your wisdom.
Dr. Ikard: It's been fun. It's been fun.
Shay: Before you go, did you want to advertise your TED talk in February?
Dr. Ikard: Yes, I'm, um. . . I did a TEDx talk in Nashville, TEDx Nashville. Now, it's been almost a year and a half ago, maybe even two years. And they usually select a handful of the thousands of TEDx talks to go to the main ted.com website. And they selected mine on the white washing a black history.
Jo: Yay [claps hands]—
Dr. Ikard: —and, um, I think— I'm looking it upright now— it's February the third or the fifth when it's going to debut, it's going to be a launch of that on Ted.com, and and also like, if people want to. . . interested in my art— I talked about you know, that's I paint— ikardgallery.com, please come look, enjoy. And if you're so inclined, you certainly can purchase. Everything is all for sale, all original, but there's, there's also a few prints, but I love black people, and I paint things that represent people that look like me that I don't oftentimes see, right, in art galleries and mainstream. I mean, it's it's an empowering thing. I absolutely love it. I do. So yeah, check me out.
Jo: Amazing.
Shay: Will do.
Jo: Yes, we will.
Shay: Well, thank you.
Dr. Ikard: Indeed, thank you.
[Transition: "Hip Hop Instrumental 2" by Ketsa]
Shay: So as mentioned in the interview, we will link resources to the black literature that Dr. Ikard stated, along with information about his February TED Talk and his art gallery—
Jo:— which are amazing, by the way—
Shay: — you should really take a look at it. We'd like to thank Dr. Ikard again for talking with us today. We appreciate all of the beautiful insights that you provided with us, and we hope that our listeners take a lot of what you had to say to their own heart.
Jo: Yeah, it was really amazing. Thank you so much, just for your intelligent and brilliant mind. And just your everything, you're literally amazing.
Jo: For the org that we're advertising today, we will be talking to the Vice President of Hidden Dores, Kaylin Davis. And we'll be talking to her about her organization and how you can get involved.
Jo: Kaylin, would you please tell us a little bit about Hidden Dores?
Kaylin: Yeah, so I'm Kaylin I'm VP of Hidden Dores. We're a student activism organization here on campus, started in 2015 circa 2015, and this year, we're working on a campaign for our dining workers and custodial staff. So if you would like to be involved in such a movement, you can reach out to us on Anchorlink, just send us a request. I manage the page, so you'll be approved in like 24 hours—
[laughs]
Kaylin:— is when it normally happens. And then you'll be on our mailing list, and then you'll get all the updates for all the events that we do on campus, people that we're working with, our coalition that we're partnering with this semester. That's going to be a really big deal. So, check us out!
Jo:— sounds amazing.
Shay: Thank you. We will link Kaylin's email in the description if you guys have more questions about Hidden Dores, but definitely check out their Anchorlink. They're an amazing organization—
Jo:— yes, and their exec board is primarily women of color—
Shay: —yes—
Jo: — so it's really amazing, like, just to see that at Vanderbilt—
Kaylin: — it's all women of color—
Shay: —support our women of color—
Jo:— all women? So spicy.
Shay: Thank you again, Kaylin.
Kaylin: Thank you.
Shay: So just like Kaylin, if you'd like to be featured on our show to advertise your own org, be sure to reach us through our email or through one of our various social media platforms. And also, if you have any comments or questions, you can do the same thing and/or you can send us a voice message through our Anchor profile.
Jo: You know where to find us, because we're everywhere.
Shay: We're everywhere.
Jo: Also, just thank you to everyone who's been involved in this episode: Dr. David Ikard, Kaylin, Shay— of course, my co-host [laughs]—
Shay: —and Jo'-Hannah, my co-host.
Jo: But yeah, we just hope you guys have a good rest of your week, or start of your week because we always upload Saturday 4 PM tea time—
["Hip Hop Instrumental 2" by Ketsa]
Shay: —tea time. And finally, we'd like to again thank Anchor for hosting our podcast. If you guys want to make your own podcast, be sure to go to the anchor website at anchor.fm or download the anchor app.
Jo: It's amazing. It's super fun, very free.
Shay: Thanks, guys. See you next week.
Jo: This has been Black Tea. Thanks for listening.
Jo & Shay: Cheers!
[glass clinking sound]
[Outro: "Hip Hop Instrumental 2" by Ketsa]
Resources:
To listen to Dr. Ikard's TedX talk, go to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bb04xj7LS34&t=56s.
and, to see and/or purchase his art, check out https://www.ikardgallery.com/.
To learn more about the Combahee River Collective, read their statement of purposes, or learn more about the topic of black feminism, check out the following links!
For information about events that the Vanderbilt Black Cultural Center (BCC) is hosting, go to https://www.vanderbilt.edu/bcc/bhm-events/.
Black Femenist anthology: All the Women are White, All the Blacks are Men, But Some of Us are Brave, https://www.feministpress.org/books-a-m/but-some.
Black Macho and the Myth of Superwoman, Michele Wallace https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/643996/black-macho-and-the-myth-of-the-superwoman-by-michele-wallace/.
Kimberlé Crenshaw's Ted Talk on intersectionality: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akOe5-UsQ2o.
Credits
Shay Milner, co-host
Jo'Hannah Valentin, co-host
Music by Ketsa at https://freemusicarchive.org/
Episode edited with Audacity
What we're drinking: Earl Grey Black Tea, https://www.bigelowtea.com/Teas/Tea-Type/Black-Tea/Earl-Grey-Tea.
Today's black history event: The Combahee River Collective. For more resources, check out this episode's transcript!
Quote of the day: "When I dare to be powerful— to use my strength in the service of my vision— then it becomes less and less important whether I am afraid" —Audre Lorde.
Self-care tip of the day: "Start taking compliments like a champ." https://bestlifeonline.com/self-care-tips/
If you want to create your own podcast, be sure to go to Anchor.fm!
Check out Hidden Dores https://anchorlink.vanderbilt.edu/organization/hiddendores! For more information, you can email Vice President Kaylin Davis at kaylin.davis@vanderbilt.edu.
We want to hear from you! You can reach us through our email, website, or our social media outlets.
Email: blackteainquiry@gmail.com
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Platforms
Our podcast can be found at: https://anchor.fm/johannah-chanteria
Episode transcript found at: blackteapodcast.wixsite.com/podcast/episodes/episode-4-black-tea-politics-of-black-gender